"[Alfred the Great's] unique importance in the history of English letters comes from his conviction that a life without knowledge or reflection was unworthy of respect..."
Sir Frank Stenton
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Wednesday, April 15, 2009
The Sheep and the Goats
This post has moved to my new blog at http://www.salvomag.com/unpragmatic-thoughts/?p=2922
If you consider an early date for the Revelation the parable could very well be a referance to AD 70 especially since John begins the Revelation stating it is about things which must shortly to come to pass and also that they are "at hand" Charles Bowers
Does it have to be one or the other, AD 70 or Christ's final return? Can it not be both, because it is descriptive of the way Christ's judgement works?
It is, after all, a commonplace that something that has happened historically in scripture is also a figure of that which is to come. Why can it not be talking specifically about the soon-to-be judgement of Jerusalem but also have larger things to say about eternal and final judgement?
And for that matter, why must we assume that judgement of AD 70 is temporal and not eternal? Could it not be both? Does God have different kinds of justice for this earth and the next?
I noticed that you have revised your comments since the last time I read them. I guess I'll need to save each revision. I particularly liked your comments about “Eternal Life” and “Everlasting Punishment” from the last revision. Are those still available?
[iv] There is not space to discuss the matter here, but a compelling case can be made for reading Matthew 24 and the parallel section of Mark 13 as referring to Christ’s “coming” in judgment at AD 70.
I am pretty much "Postmillennial" in my eschatology and even Preterist to a point but still the "Sermon on the Mount" remains the greatest "Hell Fire & Brimstone" sermon ever delivered. The partial judgment of the Roman armies are only a "first fruits" of the judgment to come. The sermon on the mount including the judgments are a reality that exists between the church and the world until Jesus returns - and of course we confess "He will come again to JUDGE the living and the dead and of His Kingdom there will be no end." This parable has to do with the sheep caring and the goats not caring "In as much as you did (or didn't do) it to the least of THESE MY BRETHREN you did (or didn't) do it unto ME." In other words, judgment would be based a great deal on the reception or lack of reception of the Church, Christ's living body on earth. Further we have eternal life NOW in a developmental form to enter into it perfectly formed in eternity. The one does not negate the other. Similarly the damned have eternal death NOW in developmental form and will enter into it's full and perfected form in eternity. If fact that is what the NEW BIRTH (or "re-conception") is about. It is the "natural" destiny of all the children of Adam. The present state of being an object of wrath does not negate the future state perfected for all eternity in the fires of hell.
If you consider an early date for the Revelation the parable could very well be a referance to AD 70 especially since John begins the Revelation stating it is about things which must shortly to come to pass and also that they are "at hand"
ReplyDeleteCharles Bowers
Does it have to be one or the other, AD 70 or Christ's final return? Can it not be both, because it is descriptive of the way Christ's judgement works?
ReplyDeleteIt is, after all, a commonplace that something that has happened historically in scripture is also a figure of that which is to come. Why can it not be talking specifically about the soon-to-be judgement of Jerusalem but also have larger things to say about eternal and final judgement?
And for that matter, why must we assume that judgement of AD 70 is temporal and not eternal? Could it not be both? Does God have different kinds of justice for this earth and the next?
I noticed that you have revised your comments since the last time I read them. I guess I'll need to save each revision. I particularly liked your comments about “Eternal Life” and “Everlasting Punishment”
ReplyDeletefrom the last revision. Are those still available?
I haven't revised it and my comments about eternal life and eternal punishment are still there.
ReplyDelete[iv] There is not space to discuss the matter here, but a compelling case can be made for reading Matthew 24 and the parallel section of Mark 13 as referring to Christ’s “coming” in judgment at AD 70.
ReplyDeleteDo you discuss the matter somewhere else?
I am pretty much "Postmillennial" in my eschatology and even Preterist to a point but still the "Sermon on the Mount" remains the greatest "Hell Fire & Brimstone" sermon ever delivered. The partial judgment of the Roman armies are only a "first fruits" of the judgment to come. The sermon on the mount including the judgments are a reality that exists between the church and the world until Jesus returns - and of course we confess "He will come again to JUDGE the living and the dead and of His Kingdom there will be no end." This parable has to do with the sheep caring and the goats not caring "In as much as you did (or didn't do) it to the least of THESE MY BRETHREN you did (or didn't) do it unto ME." In other words, judgment would be based a great deal on the reception or lack of reception of the Church, Christ's living body on earth. Further we have eternal life NOW in a developmental form to enter into it perfectly formed in eternity. The one does not negate the other. Similarly the damned have eternal death NOW in developmental form and will enter into it's full and perfected form in eternity. If fact that is what the NEW BIRTH (or "re-conception") is about. It is the "natural" destiny of all the children of Adam. The present state of being an object of wrath does not negate the future state perfected for all eternity in the fires of hell.
ReplyDeleteBlessings,
PML+